[Lisa Dahlgren]

Initial Post: I am kind of late jumping in here. I have been on Quest, and that took all of my attention prior to going, and of course, the time of actually being there. But I am enjoying reading the posts, and am so glad to hear from you guys.

I have a client that I have been working with for several months. He has a lot of rage, going back to when he was a child, and then through his teen years until now. He reports he does not remember much of his childhood, but feels there is “no reason” for his rage. He is a vet, and although he says he didn’t feel he fit well in the armed services, he blames what he feels is his difficulty in man-ing up and just powering through difficult times, as why he didn’t fit. He has two young girls now and is the primary care-giver for them and is extremely interested in being calm and reassuring toward them when they challenge him, rather than exploding in rage as he has been prone to do.

We have used a number of brain change principles, starting with identifying him as approaching our sessions in a contemplation and planning stage of change. Initially, he and I had to negotiate even how to talk to one another as he tended to take exception to things he felt I meant toward him, or even him feeling comfortable enough to explain what was happening for him. He was extremely attuned to what type of vibe I was sending out and as we identified that his system was hyperaroused almost constantly for particular vibes regarding emotional safety, I did a lot of education about the nervous system and why this may be occurring for him. So I relied a lot on mirror neurons to allow myself to understand better his internal process, provide reflection, and to provide him with a calm and open presence when he was reporting on things that upset his system. Building that structure and trust allowed him to begin trying new methods of self-soothing, which as he had success with that contributed to him feeling more enthusiastic about moving even more into the planning and action phases of change.

As one aspect of the work began to build on another, reinforcing even other aspects of work, shifts began to happen fairly rapidly. He now contemplates what he wants to achieve at each session, and is more open to trying experiments both inside and outside of the time we have together. One type of exercise that I have been taught before is a “toggleing” exercise. In this exercise, he begins in an emotionally neutral, meditative, state. He then reflects on something that in the past would arouse his system and attempts to really feel his body heating up-internally coaching himself to focus and concentrate on the sensation. Then, he asks himself to mentally dial it down to neutral again. And then, swings to the side of the sensations he wants to feel regardless of the external events-in general feelings of being grounded and connected to himself, open, breathing easily, calm mind, etc., Asks himself to turn up those feelings, then down and return to neutral. After he has toggled back and forth several times, it is much more difficult for him to get aroused, and much easier to stay in a calm, confident state.
Perhaps this exercise was outlined during the days I missed at the last toolbox, but if it was not, it is one I find very useful.

[Lisa Dahlgren]

Summary Post
I had a chance to try to listen to the parts work audio from Starhouse. Most of what I listened to was too soft or too static to understand. Drat. What I could hear was really great, and I realized I was getting even more of what Michael was saying than as we did our own parts work.

I have been working the mandala-style of parts work with one particular client. It has been a little bumpy, which I put down to me not quite making the transfer to a mandala style, yet. I am used to what feels like, for lack of a different word, smaller parts.

But despite it feeling bumpy to me, my client is hanging in there and utilizing her parts to see in particular, “what part or parts get between Soul and vision” for her. She goes back to that question repeatedly as she works her mandala. Then she offers some of those parts that keep coming between Soul and vision something she feels they are looking for. For example, a part of her is always striving and in particular strives to finish her schooling. When that part is in the driver’s seat she gets overwhelmed and does things that end up overwhelming her. So she offers that part recognition and appreciation when it steps between Soul and her vision of being in ministry. It then becomes a help-mate, rather than take over.

It has been delightful reading your posts. I so appreciate us all doing this together. See you soon at Starhouse!

[Lisa Dahlgren]

Hello everyone!

So good to read all the posts. I am behind the times in getting this post out there. But there was a lot of hockey watching that I couldn’t miss. And now my Blues have won the Stanley Cup for the first time ever. So I can get back to slightly more productive things than wringing my hands and jumping up and down singing “Gloria”.

Parts work. Love it. It really is transformational. It seems to get at everything that I look at as being helpful. It helps to generate perspective and that “metta” position. It de-pathalogizes (is that a word?). It breaks difficult things into manageable parts. It is intuitive. It can be done by clients outside of sessions once they get the hang of it. But most importantly, clients feel the shift inside of them, helping them make almost instant changes and learning to rely and trust themselves.

I first found a parts model when I was introduced to energy medicine and shamanic practice. When I watched a demo of it done by Richard Schwartz (a different model of parts but incorporates a lot of the same things), I felt that what I witnessed was a soul retrieval done in an office setting. And I was hooked. I have never been sorry that I have dedicated most of my training in the past 8 years to learning more about parts work.

Just like every model, though, it isn’t for everyone who walks in my door. In part because our culture doesn’t embrace some of these ideas yet, some clients feel they are not comfortable thinking of parts. Some still become overwhelmed with their parts or feel they have evil parts of them that want to make them suffer or harm them. But using basic listening skills and being mindful of where clients are at means that when it isn’t right for them we just use other things to help calm their system, work toward their goals, and accomplish things. Later, as things get easier I will cycle back into part language and invite part work again. So sometimes it is just waiting and helping in other ways, then the part work is just right.

Sorry I didn’t participate sooner in this, but glad to get connected to you all now.

[Lisa Dahlgren]

Summary post,

I feel the same way, Ben. It is great to hear others are dealing with the same things, and that sometimes the same type of experiment just isn’t right for a person as it was for the other.

I have a tendency to slip back into my usual, comfortable, style with people. Some of that is very productive, and some of it I would prefer to not slip back into. When that happens the first thing I do when I notice that is go to my vision council and be with that. I still find that so profound. Not only do I then feel so supported, but I feel so much more relaxed and peaceful. I even feel like I am seeing the other person in a whole different way. Almost like I suddenly know them as one of my best friends from a long time ago and I am just getting a chance to really hear about their life journey and get “caught up”. It seems weird in a way, but it is so pronounced that it never fails to impress me with good feelings. The next thing I do is go to the fundamentals that we learned at the intensive regarding deep listening and reflecting. For me, if I am slipping into something that doesn’t work as well as I was thinking it might, doing those things turns things around fast. I still get bothered at times with thoughts such as, “is this enough?”. But my clients almost always give me some sense that I have maintained being where it is helpful for them.

Despite my best efforts, I still don’t have anyone that I have taken outside, much less tried a true gestalt experience on outside. I still don’t understand how to use gestalt in anything other than a verbal manner without it really being NCC. I am still open to hearing about other’s experiences in that manner to help me learn. But overall, it has been great connecting with those that were on this string and I appreciate all your comments and support.

And here we are again, where I get to say: Go Blues! Man it would be something if they won the Stanley Cup.

[Lisa Dahlgren]

How I established the Coaching Relationship and focus the session?
Although I have established a therapy relationship very often, it is different for me to establish a coaching relationship. Right now this is done with people who call inquiring about doing therapy with me. So I know it is a switch for them to think about coaching instead of therapy. So I feel like I really have two tasks to do-establish a coaching contract, and a coaching relationship. By coaching contract, I don’t mean a piece of paper they read and sign, but being up front with what they can expect from coaching, and having some assurance that the client has the same expectations. Therefore, I do this in a very straightforward manner, explaining the differences between coaching and therapy and explaining why I think they would benefit from coaching. Then, if the client has said that they agree that a coaching model is right for them, we proceed in that manner. For the folks who originally came for therapy but after we discuss it feel the coaching model is for them, I take an extra step. The first few times I feel that we are getting to a place where a coaching model is different than a therapy model, I mention it, saying something like, “well, if we were doing therapy right now I might say______’, but since we are following a coaching way of looking at things, what I want to say is_____”. At the end of the session I do a little debriefing time, asking what came up for them at those junctures. What I am looking for in that debriefing is my client understanding that we have maintained a coaching session and the client is comfortable with that.

The coaching relationship seems to me to be establishing a coaching presence. So that is basically respectful, open, thoughtful, non-judgmental reflecting and listening. Then going on to clarify and summarize the main issue, and start moving it toward an understanding of the deeper need, all while keeping an intention of promoting forward movement and positive change. I focus the session by beginning with a short recap of where we left things off and what they had agreed to accomplish between our sessions, then asking for an update. From there we continue on.

How did or would a Gestalt approach fit into a nature connected coaching session? So this is more difficult for me, for basically two reasons. In my office, Gestalt techniques seem to take us to threshold easily because the techniques seem to incorporate the same things that threshold in nature-connected coaching brings. That is, moving in the here and now, utilizing as much somatic or body-centered approach as possible, being real, looking for congruence, etc. So I am not sure if Gestalt “fits” into nature connected coaching, or really just does the same thing NCC does but in an interpersonal, office-based, manner. It is also difficult for me to answer this question because I have yet to have a session, termed coaching or therapy, that is in a natural setting. They have all been in my office. So, yikes. I am really hoping that some of the posts will stir my understanding and imagination for this.

So I will just name the similarities between Gestalt and NCC that I notice: The idea of doing experiments, the manner in which we ask about what is coming up for a person as we move through threshold and what that leads them to, the fact that nature contacts individuals in a steady and real sense, with no judgment, and because of the way nature maintains a steady boundary and people change their feelings about and to nature-that is, break contact with nature by projecting onto nature their desires, inner conflicts, and fears.

As you can probably guess, at this time I do not feel that learning about Gestalt therapy has changed much about how I am doing my coaching. I still rely a lot on what we were taught in the first intensive, and other things that I have learned about through being taught how to do therapy. Things such as experiments, hear and now, body-centered, boundaries, contact, congruence, introjects, projection…all of those things seem to me to have already been a part of what we were taught and what we do as we take people through threshold in nature. Gestalt therapy seems to be a way to do those things when we are not in nature, and so are enacting a primarily person-to-person intervention.

So the things that I do in my office that seem to me to be elements of Gestalt therapy, are: maintaining contact and being observant when contact is broken, relating issues that clients bring as happening outside of them to the inner dynamics or conflicts of my client, experiments both during sessions and between sessions, and bringing things into the here and now. I suppose I do other things that are Gestalt-like as well.

One thing I like to do because it seems to help individuals really get a grasp and a hold on their deeper need, follows from when we are able to distill their deeper need to a relatively simple sentence. So for example, I will make up a client: “Jill” -a 50-something mom who feels devastated that her 28 year old son did not reach out to her on mother’s day, (they have had a good relationship) feels trapped into sending him only loving notes and forgivenesses, much as she felt and expressed toward her parents when her parents lost emotional control when she was a child and blamed her for their extreme anger outbursts toward her. One of her deeper needs is to allow herself to express dissatisfaction in relationships in which she has not been treated in right relationship. Lets say that as we are meeting and she is explaining the situation and her feelings of helplessness about it, she mentions he is a 28 year old man-in a manner that is as if it excuses him from being confronted by her for his dismissal of her (her “old” way of feeling and thinking). In this case I would ask her if she would be willing to “try something different”- which is something I often say as a way to introduce an experiment, and ask her if she would close her eyes and just listen to what I said and let me know what came up for her as I did that. After she agrees and closes her eyes, I would simply say her own words, “He is a 28 year old man”, and listen to what comes up. Generally, the first thing that is mentioned is how the person is used to dealing with or feeling in the situation. So, “Jill” would probably tell me about how her 28 year old son is very tender and unable to really think about relationships and so needs a pass when he hurts someone. Then I just reflect back to them what came up for them-no discussion or interpretations, etc. I then ask my client to put those initial sensations “on the emotional bookcase, so you can listen to what else comes up for you”, and say the exact words again, “He is a 28 year old man”. And listen to what comes up next, reflect it-then ask for that to go on the emotional bookcase. After we have done this a few times, we generally get past a lot of the defenses, and the client begins to be in touch with the deeper need. The defenses for “Jill” might include feelings about being uncomfortable speaking up to a man, feelings that she is to blame for her son’s behavior since she is her mother, feelings she might be punished for speaking up for herself, feelings that she is angry at him for other things, feelings that if she stands up for her self she is too much, etc. In general, people get to their deeper need as we just listen to what comes up and put it on the emotional bookcase. So for Jill it might be she ends by saying, “That is right, he is a grown, 28 year old man, and I can be firm and loving as I tell him he has hurt my feelings, because he has hurt my feelings.”

I find that sequence can be used for so many things regarding the deeper need. It seems to be more powerful when the sentence came from the client, and/or, their name can be used in the sentence.

So I am very much interested in reading what others post because I am feeling somewhat at a loss in putting the Gestalt techniques out into nature, not just in the office.

I have only one more thing to say right now, and that is: Go Blues! This is first time for them to get to the Stanley Cup Hockey Finals in 49 years. I got my post done now because I know I will soon be taking up a lot of time watching them play. Any Boston fans out there?

[Lisa Dahlgren]

I meant to do a summary post, but didn’t mark it as done, and don’t see it now. So I will go ahead and do one now. I just re-read all the posts from this foundation, and now that we have had another week together the things that are said seem even more real and alive to me. I found myself lingering over several sections of other’s posts, especially when we were talking about trust and what a big impact that has on work as a coach. Just tonight, re-reading MJs posts, also got me thinking back on all the different times I have been an observer and have observed such different ways of coaching. And different ways we all show up as clients! With more experience with EBI than when we first created these particular posts the things that we discussed seem to becoming even more true.

[Lisa Dahlgren]

Summary Post: It has been wonderful reading all of the posts and watching as this module has unfolded. I know I am in a deeper place as I am getting closer to the heart of understanding my vision and beginning to move into the creation stage. And I am finding that thread in the words of all of your posts, which contributes to a feeling of support and is so very helpful to staying in a creative space.
As I have spent more time on the web looking at posts and websites that seem to offer aspects of what I want to offer I am experiencing a variety of emotions and insights, which are also helping me tune into what I have/want to offer. Some of the websites seem to discuss a person and that person’s work as so, well, perfect or amazing or wonderful, that I wonder why the entire earth has not yet been healed by the person writing the website. And some strike me as being over-stepping, such as coining terms from different cultures without an apparent awareness of what the terms actually mean and the value of those words on a deeper level. I have needed to remind myself when those things come up to keep doing a “You-turn”, that is, to turn it back to myself and explore as deeply as I can why those things don’t sit well with me. And then to explore the value of both my views on that way of doing things and their way of doing things. And as I do that I am again so grateful for all of the voices that come through in the posts because each one is standing at a different place in this circle and so for me, you all sharing your journey helps support my finding balance. And as Ben M shared, support is so important.

I think I am developing some clearer sense of my vision through all of this. I have now pared down feeling I will work with anyone, to a somewhat smaller set of individuals. And have a much better sense of who my “ideal” client is. Mom’s and their daughters have entered into my service circle. As have those who can imagine honoring all of their parts. Still, this question is a work in progress.

[Lisa Dahlgren]

Hey Ben, I missed that you did the exercise about swinging back and forth, too. sorry about that. got in a rush. I think that exercise is really, really helpful for people, even in the moments in which they are getting overwhelmed with their memories as they tell me about what is going on with them. Does it seem to you like there are multiple parts at work with your client, some that even feel a bit overwhelmed when she feels “better”?

[Lisa Dahlgren]

Hey Ben,

I loved the way you sensed into things to try for your client. I bet that if the eight point hadn’t hit the mark, you would have a whole other bunch of things that would have sprung to mind to try. I have worked with people who have “I don’t know” as their main feeling, and sometimes I can feel a little bit of, well, almost concern, about how to proceed. Kind of like rock climbing and getting to a very smooth surface, like, “where can I get some purchase? How is this possibly going to be done?”, and not seeing even little tiny cracks to work with. Seems like you kind of mentally fell back and regrouped with yourself and decided what tools to try. Neat experience. I am glad I am not the only one that has had those sensations when working with someone.

[Lisa Dahlgren]

Hey Ben,
I bet you have a lot going on! Good luck with everything. I will soon be meeting my first client outside, and am still looking for ways gestalt work fits with NCC in practical vs. theoretical ways. You mention you did three back-to-back experiments. The concept of experiments seems to me to be with both gestalt and NCC, so my question is, when you look back at those experiments were any of them fitting more with gestalt than NCC? And if so, can you give me a brief glimpse of what the experiments were? I am eager to understand how the concepts unique to gestalt are put into practical ways out of doors. In the end it doesn’t matter, I know, because when you do as you did and go with the flow of the time with a client it works best. But I am still playing with the concepts in my head so I can get the best possible feel for them. I appreciate any insights nd wisdom from your experiences you can give me.

[Lisa Dahlgren]

Hi Sheri,

Whoo-hoooooo! Congratulations on taking this step, and all that it entails for you. I just returned from the first toolbox intensive and am still really stoked by the learning that occurred as well as the personal transformation I see in myself. What a great gift you are giving yourself. I am here for you in whatever way feels right for you as you go through the application process and are on the path of growth and change. The very best to you and thank you for posting what you decided to do.

Lisa

[Lisa Dahlgren]

Hi Cory,

Reading your post I mused on how I only know you as the person who shows up in his authentic self. I have no concept of you seeming to live in any other way. Hard to even imagine since your spiritual, genuine, self seems so natural! I think that you captured in your post what has been rattling inside of me when you talk about people being taken deeper. That is kind of what I was trying to get at when I was thinking about the serious edge to what I want to do. Thank you for helping me find words to explore what I am sensing into for myself.

[Lisa Dahlgren]

Hello Brooke, It was great to hear you on our last call! Your visions and way of putting together the many facets of nature and more urban life are so inspirational to me. Wanting to take it deeper with people is something I really resonate with. As I am working to understand who my ideal client is, it is so very helpful to see how others are putting things together. I am fascinated with you being called to work with vets and wonder what you might see, if you do, is the common value or thread between vets, and middle-aged women, and the others you talk about serving. I am asking that of myself as I collect, so to speak, this seemingly varied group of people that are starting to fit into my service circle. But it is still a bit elusive for me even as I spend time contemplating that. Wishing that answers you have found can inspire me again so I can continue to hone in on my ideal client. You know, copy from the smart girl. Of course, I am really copying from everyone. So I appreciate all the posts. And really appreciated yours. See you all in just a few days!

[Lisa Dahlgren]

Hey Ben,

Every time I hear about your interlocking, multifaceted, programs I am so impressed. You have amazing ideas and it is just so great that you put things into practice. I think I hear you when you say you want to move from believing that what ever client comes to you is your ideal client, to a place where you know you really fit and the client fits for you. I struggle with the same issue, and so remain indecisive about who is my “ideal” client.

Kudos to you for all the things you are making happen, your vision, your persistence, and patience. Looking forward to seeing you soon!

[Lisa Dahlgren]

Hey Sandy,

I like your passion and vision of taking young adults and elder adults into a time of reflection and self-awareness. I feel like I have observed the same thing about a lack of acknowledgement of different times of passages in a typical life and how when that is not addressed a life can be hollow and individuals feel disconnected from themselves and their community. I really resonated with the things that you pointed out. You seem to be a good match for what you write about.